Before he got married six years ago, Antonio, now 29, was responsible about managing debt. He used credit cards, but paid them off in full each month.
After he and Emi, 32, got married, he bought her a $3,000 ring, which he says was the first purchase he knew he wouldn’t be able to pay off right away, he told self-made millionaire and money expert Ramit Sethi on a recent episode of his “I Will Teach You to be Rich” podcast. Their last names were not used.
When Sethi asked how long it took him to pay it off, “it snowballed,” Antonio said. “I couldn’t even tell you.”
From there, the couple fell into a vicious debt cycle, racking up thousands on credit cards, paying them off — often with tools like personal loans or other financing options — and then finding themselves back in debt shortly after. They once paid off $77,000 in credit card debt using Emi’s emergency savings.
“The feeling of bad never stopped,” Emi said of the debt cycle. “We never got past it, but I don’t think there has been a day since then that we haven’t talked about finances or stressed about finances or prayed. It’s been a snowball effect since.”
The couple had made huge strides in bettering their financial situation by the time they spoke with Sethi. They’d paid off their credit card debt, but still owed $60,000 in student loans and only had $1,500 in savings.
Here’s how they wound up in a years-long battle with debt and how they plan to avoid more turmoil in the future.
Emi has a ‘blind spot’ for money
Like many couples interviewed on Sethi’s podcast, Emi and Antonio have a problem talking about money. Antonio previously handled all the couple’s finances, including paying the bills and keeping an eye on the budget, while Emi said she had her “head in the sand.”
As a therapist herself, Emi has a deep understanding of psychology and how it translates to her behavior. “But when it comes to money, I do not know. I can’t self-analyze,” she said on the podcast. “I can’t figure out why my relationship with money is what it is. There’s a blind spot there.”
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Putting all the financial responsibility on Antonio exacerbated their problems because Emi would continue to spend money Antonio knew they didn’t have.
Speaking with Sethi helped Antonio open up about wanting her to be a partner in their finances. In response, Emi made a commitment to educating herself to feel more empowered about money so she can be a good teammate.
Antonio can’t say no
The couple admittedly has an overspending problem. But they aren’t splurging on travel or luxury cars. It’s smaller line items, like going out to eat and buying things for their young daughter, on top of high fixed costs that sent Emi and Antonio into the red.
Antonio said he struggles to say “no” when his family wants things or he wants to do things for them.
“Our track record speaks for itself,” he said. “For one reason or another, even [though] I was in charge of the finances … whether it be my overspending or not making enough, we still ended up in debt again and again and again.”
Acknowledging all of this out loud helped the couple realize Antonio had a knowledge gap when it came to financial decisions that may not have been the best for their family, such as refinancing their home to pay off credit cards and auto debt.
After trimming down their fixed costs to as low as they could realistically get, Sethi said their “easy options” are gone. But they both have the capacity to increase their incomes, which Sethi said should be their main objective to help pay down the rest of their debt and boost their savings.
‘My parents aren’t good with money’
Though they’ve made progress toward getting out of debt, Emi and Antonio fear they’ll fall back into their old ways, the way they have before. Their pattern of overspending has been and will be difficult to break because it’s been sneaky in the past, Sethi said.
“What I see is a series of mundane day-to-day decisions which people make because they’re easy and they don’t understand how to connect today’s decision to tomorrow’s consequence,” he said.
They can make a change, he added, “if the stakes are high enough.”
He asked the couple to consider their daughter and how she might react in a few years down the road if they don’t break their debt cycle. Emi said they would look unstable as a couple. “‘My parents aren’t good with money,'” Antonio imagined their daughter would think.
“She’ll tell herself that she’s not good at it,” Emi said. “She’ll put her head in the sand. She’ll avoid it. And she’ll say, ‘That’s for my partner. That’s for my dad. That’s not for me.’ And I don’t want that for her.”
The couple left Sethi with plans to make some serious changes to tackle the rest of their student debt and boost their emergency savings.
“No more avoiding,” Emi said.
Check out the full episode here.
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